Brand Deals for Thought Leaders: How to Monetize Your Authority with Justin Moore

Dustin: [00:00:00] Welcome back to the Seven Figure Leap podcast. Uh, I am delighted today to bring you Justin Moore. Uh, for a lot of reasons as we get into his story, uh, I find a lot of parallels to my own entrepreneurial journey and some of the things we've wrestled with as husbands and fathers on this, this same kind of crazy journey of experimentation and, and kind of finding our way entrepreneurially.
Dustin: Justin and I actually connected in a room in Boise, uh, six months ago, I guess, at Craft and Commerce. Didn't know each other at all. Kind of shook hands and had a casual introduction. And I started following him and started finding this like amazing niche expertise around sponsorships. And as we'll get into as part of the story here, that's become front and center with some stuff I've done recently in my own business.
Dustin: And he was gracious enough. He's got a new book out that we're going to talk a lot about. He's gracious enough to come on and teach us about sponsorships and why he does the things he does. So Justin, it's an honor to have you here, man. I'm really excited to dig in, get to know you better, understand your story.
Dustin: Learn a lot from you. So wherever you think is most appropriate for our audience, like pick it up [00:01:00] on your journey. So we can start to understand and unpack like why you end up in such a really cool, but obscure niche of being like the sponsorships guy.
Justin: dude, I appreciate that so much. And just the power of connection. Right, bro. We were in a room and like, you know, just the, the, um, the beautiful, uh, friendships and fruits that, uh, you know, connecting, especially in person can bear. I just love it. So excited to be here, man. And I think the quick story is that, like, you know, I was an engineer by background.
Justin: Like I went to school for engineering. I never, ever in a million years thought I was going to be like, yeah, Creating content on the internet, you know, like calling myself a creator or an influencer or anything like that. Like I was very much like, you know, just thought my career trajectory was going to be the professional kind of nine to five corporate setting.
Justin: And what happened was my wife, April started a YouTube channel at the time. She's my girlfriend or fiance, um, at the time started a YouTube
channel in 2009. So this was way back in the day. Uh, it was really not Established that like a career path was like being a YouTuber or being a creator because like the partner program was just [00:02:00] starting, uh, you know, like, in fact, it was application only at that time.
Justin: Like, you know, we had to apply and she got rejected three times. It was like very much like, you know, uh, exciting thing to like, wow, we're gonna make a revenue share. But in the early days, it was a passion man for her. It was not, you know, she was a preschool teacher. And so after work on weekends, she would started making content about, uh, skincare, cosmetics, makeup.
Justin: That was really a passion. She hadn't, she didn't have a job. friends in real life who were into that kind of thing. So she was like, let me find this, you know, community on the internet. Um, and you know, things like picked up pretty quickly for her, but it wasn't like she's making tons of money. Remember, she got rejected from the program.
Justin: It was like, you know, buying all this stuff herself. But what quickly started to happen was that brands started to reach out, not offering to pay her, but to send her free stuff. And that was so thrilling to her, right? Cause it was like, we were in our early twenties, no money. Um, and so the idea that someone would send her like a 30 makeup palette for free was like, Oh, she was over the moon for that.
Justin: And that was the way it was for years to us. And it wasn't like we wised up after like a month. It was [00:03:00] like, no, for like 34 years, it was like free stuff. Let's go, you know, just like shipments and shipments. Um, and, um, basically what happens, I decided to go back to school, uh, to get my MBA at night after work.
Justin: Um, and, you know, I was always kind of had the entrepreneurial bug, like Working on little side hustles on the, uh, you know, not, but it wasn't like, Oh, this is going to be my new business or something. And so I just basically started taking these classes all around advertising and marketing and negotiation.
Justin: And I just kind of the gears started turning. And one day I went to April and I was like, I feel like you're getting the short end of the stick here. Like, we're seeing hundreds of all these comments on all your videos where it was like, Oh, wow. Thank you so much. I've never heard about this brand or I just went to the store and bought it.
Justin: Thanks April. And it was like, we're getting a free 30 bag of potato chips on the other side of this. And we're like, I don't know, something, something seems wrong here. And so I said, okay, the next brand that reaches out to you, uh, ask if they have a collaboration Budget to pay you and she's like, there's no way any brands ever gonna be willing to pay me.
Justin: I was like, no, come on. Like, just give it a shot. And so sure enough, next brand that reached out, [00:04:00] she hit him with a, Hey, you got a budget? And they said, Oh yeah, if you can talk about us in two videos a month, we will pay you 700 monthly. And we were like, like our minds were absolutely blown. And like, this was the first inflection point for us.
Justin: Dustin was like, wow, there's other, there are ways to make money in this world that don't just rely on like a. nine to five paycheck, right? Where you make the same amount of money every two weeks. It's like, wow, our instant thought was like, how can we find 10 more brands just like this? Right? And so that was like the first, you know, aha moment for us.
Justin: And so fast forward over the next 10, 15 years, basically, we've done over 550 sponsorships personally made over 5 it was like one of our primary revenue streams as creators. Um, but basically around 2015, um, yeah. I think a lot of people watching or listening can probably appreciate this, which is just like my business brain was always turning.
Justin: I was like, there's no way people are gonna, like, watch us personally on our YouTube channels forever. You know, it's like things are going really well now, but like, you know, what's gonna happen in five years, 10 [00:05:00] years where people get tired of us. Um, and so I was thinking, like, how can I diversify what we're doing right now?
Justin: And so I decided to start an influencer marketing agency to basically get deals for other Our friends basically, it was like, Hey, like, I think we're doing something right here because we're getting all these repeat customers when they work with us. There's got to be some special sauce here about why that is.
Justin: And so sure enough, I kind of did the pitch and I went to these agencies and these brands that we were working with and be like, Hey, seems like, you know, this, this is an awesome campaign. Seems like you really enjoy working with us. I could actually apply the same kind of Seamless customer experience to help get partnerships with other creators and basically pay me a kind of a management or, you know, campaign management fee and I'll handle everything the liaison with the creators like you just I'm your one point of
contact and do that pitch was like shooting fish in a barrel in 2015 because brands.
Justin: Hadn't really figured out like partnerships and influencer marketing. It was still very, a very new thing. Um, and, uh, and so, you know, that agency grew very quickly. I paid, you know, ultimately paid out millions of [00:06:00] dollars to other creators. Um, and 2020 hit us in and it, and everything crumbled. So, um, you know, I, I share this story, uh, because, um, I want to talk about the really low moment in this journey for me, because I think a lot of people you hear on these like business podcasts, like it was all up into the right hockey stick growth, you know, and there's like, there's no,
Dustin: It's so easy.
Justin: it's the hockey stick.
Justin: You see the people flexing their M. R. R. A. R. R. charts on on social media, and you just don't hear the behind the scenes of the failures and the trials and tribulations. And I just want to share what happened because, like, had this not happened to me, I wouldn't be where I am today. But basically, what happened is, um, Our three main customer segments for the agency were like retail, travel and hospitality and consumer packaged goods.
Justin: And what were like, what were the three verticals that were like pulverized by the pandemic? Um, yeah. Oh, yeah, those three. And so, um, basically it was awful because I had a bunch of full time [00:07:00] employees. I had to lay everyone off and I was 100, 000 in debt. And so it was truly like the long dark night of the soul, man.
Justin: I was like, I, for years I had been telling my wife, like, Trust me, this is, this is gonna be worth it. Like the long nights, the, you know, the conferences, the client meetings, like this is what's gonna finally help us round the corner as a family and be able to slow down on social media and all that. Um, and for that to have failed so spectacularly and be in debt on top of all that, man, it was so humiliating for me as like a husband, as a father, as a professional.
Justin: Um, and I just didn't know if there was gonna be like a next act for me. Yeah. Candidly, dude.
Dustin: Going back to engineering, right?
Justin: dude. Yeah. Yeah. I guess I'm gonna have to go back to, you know, and we were terrified about the global health crisis, you know? Um, and so it was in this really, really low wallow. I had a good wallow sesh for a while there, dude.
Justin: And I basically realized, like, well, I've got this pretty interesting thing. Um, [00:08:00] perspective actually now where I've been a creator in the trenches for many, many years doing deals. Um, but I also have been on the other side of it. Now I've been in the boardrooms with a lot of these brands and agencies where they're like, Hey, we don't want to spend 10 K with you guys.
Justin: We want to spend a million dollars across 200, you know, creators in this one campaign. What should the strategy be? They're like asking me, right? Who should we work with? What platforms? And so it's like a very different conversation. They would also say, Hey, never send us that person's profile again. We're never gonna work with them for the following three reasons, and they will never say that to that
Dustin: yeah, yeah,
Justin: right?
Justin: And yeah. And so, um, I was like, you know, this is kind of interesting. And so I just started creating some YouTube videos, dude. It wasn't like, Oh, there's gonna be my new business. It was like, Oh, like, I'm just kind of trying to scratch this creative itch, like do something. Um, and Um, People like the videos.
Justin: They were like, wow, can you make a video about this and this? And they started DMing me. Hey, can you like, I don't have a manager, but can you, I don't know what to do on this negotiation. Can you help me? How much should I charge? Um, like give a course. Can you coach me? And all these things were brand new to me, man.
Justin: Even though we've [00:09:00] been on the internet for so long, I'd never, we'd never sold anything really in earnest, like a digital product or coaching or anything like that. Um, and so it led me to this like rabbit hole of like binging Amy Porterfield's podcast for the entire back catalog. And, you know, just like learning, how do I do all Fast forward five years later, I've got this really very surprising business where I'm focusing on sponsorship coaching.
Justin: And so it's, um, it's been a trip, man.
Dustin: That's awesome. Well, Justin doesn't, doesn't know any of this, but anyone who's watching my side of this video, I'm like very ferociously like head nodding because so many parallels and it's not all that relevant, but I guess just to say I can like. Like very deeply relate to what you're saying. So my wife's a teacher, I was an engineer, 2009.
Dustin: I had a creative itch. It was less my wife, the face of the brand, although we were partners in it. And we got pulled into this whole online world through a marriage ministry that we're involved in. And just sort of like, and it was more writing than the video, but kind of the same thing. I was like, I have no idea what I'm doing.
Dustin: I have an entrepreneurial itch. I want to scratch. [00:10:00] I feel like I have some, some message to share. Um, And so, yeah, we kind of went into the side hustle business together, uh, through the years, and it pulled me into digital
marketing in a deep way versus sponsorships. And I had that same sort of experience in 2020.
Dustin: I had literally all of my clients had, I became a marketing consultant in 2018, left engineering. And so by 2020, I was a partner in a CPG brand called Firecreek Snacks that was completely filled by trade shows and handing people meat sticks to put in their mouth to random strangers. Uh, and then, and I'm like driving to a trade show and it's canceled and that's weird.
Dustin: And I come home, three kids, wife's doing zoom teaching. Uh, and all of my marketing clients were in that industry or they were local businesses. I like a dentist, a real estate broker, and they're all just shut down. Uh, and so I had a very dark several month period too. And it's really interesting, the parallels.
Dustin: The way I came out of that was like, I'm going to try being on other people's podcasts. Cause it's like other brands I [00:11:00] admire do that. And so summer 2020, I just like tried that. And then people started asking me how I was doing it. And then now it's like my whole business. So kind of like, you know, these, these last five years for you, um, out of that deep, dark recess, it like forces you to.
Dustin: Think differently, try different things, connect with different people. And it's kind of like, well, look at us now. And that's not in a, like we're so uber successful and, and everything's roses still, but wouldn't have never thought I'd be the podcast guesting guy. You probably never thought you'd be a sponsorship coach in 2025 and have like an awesome book about it.
Dustin: Um, but had you not been through the depths and despair, and I think the other thing that's really important there, it wasn't just Justin's a solo guy. He's gonna have less money for his, his beer and clubbing on the weekend. It's like, no, you're a young, you have young kids. You have a wife who you've made promises to and same thing here.
Dustin: And like, I'm going all in on this business is worth working 80 hours a week. Like, this is going to set us up and then overnight, it's all taken away through no fault of my own. Um, I [00:12:00] feel you. I guess I just want to kind of pause and say, I totally feel where you're coming from. So
Justin: dude. And, and, um, well, I just want to pause and acknowledge you, man, that like everyone has, you never know. Someone's story, you know, unless they open up and share what they've been through, and that's why I just, I really believe you have to give everyone empathy and understand, like, you know, for them to be here in this moment with you.
Justin: They've probably gone through a lot of things. Um, I think, you know, Dustin candidly, one of the reasons why I think more people don't share the lows on Um, You know, online is that I think that there's this fear. I have this fear even in the beginning before I started opening up a bit more was that like if somehow if I share my failures, people won't trust me like, Oh, I don't like I don't this guy.
Justin: You know, he has these failures like what does he know? He's trying to get me to pay him or coach him or whatever. Like I don't know. Something's weird here. Like I don't want to do it, but I just reflected my own behavior. Like I felt so much more drawn to people who shared that stuff. The vulnerable moments because I was like, Yeah, that's what I'm going through.
Justin: Like, and I just Didn't feel like I resonated with the people who were always [00:13:00] flexing and all that. And so I was like, you know, I'm just gonna be my authentic self. I'm gonna tell my real story and it's probably gonna repel some people, but the people that I attract, those are gonna be my tribe. Those are the people who really resonate with with this.
Justin: You know,
Dustin: a thousand percent. And, you know, part of what I help people with the storytelling and, and it's not manufactured. It's always like your true authentic story, but the part that we always have to dig in way deeper than they want to is.
And it's like, why do you care about this? Like, why do you care about helping these creators with sponsorships?
Dustin: That's obviously part of what we're going to talk about. You've, we've already got a great context into, um, the emotional connection you have to this world. Um, yeah, but it's like anyone who's thinking about their story, it's like, first and foremost, you need to connect with the person you want to serve
through empathy.
Dustin: Then you can talk about your authority, your credibility, and the fact that they can trust you to help them. But like. You know, we're wired for empathy and so many people, I think, especially in this influencer age, uh, do they just want to put the lipstick and polish on, uh, not as a YouTube influencer necessarily, but, uh, as a, as a [00:14:00] shield, as a mask to be like, if people really knew the real Dustin, they would never pay me, you know, or like they would never trust me to, uh, to coach them.
Dustin: So I love that you kind of led with that, uh, in the interview. So we're going to talk. Mostly about what you're up to today and the book and who you serve. I do think there's a business lesson that for some personal curiosity, as someone who did the agency marketing agency world, and then transitioned into this coaching and, and, um, strategic consulting sort of.
Dustin: Role, you had a really successful agency. Uh, you didn't end it on purpose. Basically the, uh, the economy and the environment, uh, in which you tried to operate changed. And how though, did you kind of, here's a better way to ask this. After Covid kind of settles down and you got some traction on YouTube, why didn't you just go back to the agency model?
Dustin: I think many people, when they're like. Have an area of expertise. It seems like the most direct way to monitor to monetize their expertise is like, I'll just do this for you or with you. I'll be your agency partner. And when I first met you, I was like, oh, he's like, he must [00:15:00] have a sponsorship agency. And as I got to know you, part of what I really admired is like, no, he does this different.
Dustin: This is actually really interesting. So yeah, tell us a little bit about like. Why not an agency now when you did have an agency that was successful before COVID?
Justin: it was very tempting, actually. Be to just restart everything and like, okay, things are clear, you know, we're, you know, things are opening back up
like brands are spending again. It could have been very easy for me. Just tap right back into the same Rolodex, try to hustle some more business. And, um, and that probably would have worked honestly.
Justin: But what had happened again was that I had started to see signals from these YouTube videos that I was posting and seeing the feedback that I was receiving from individual creators that the Impact it was having was like 100x the impact that my clients, the brands or the agencies that used to hire me.
Justin: Yeah, they were thankful that we helped them and like, Oh yeah, this is great. It like took some work off my plate. But like the level. Uh, just how [00:16:00] effusive people were about the help that I was providing to them to help them go from charging 500 on a on a sponsorship to 5, 000 that changes people's lives, bro. Fundamentally changes their life. It lets their spouse be able to quit. It lets them be able to stay at home with their kids. It lets them pursue this creative passion that they want to in their life. And I just started hearing these stories. Over and over basically from people who were like, you know what, like, I just don't consider myself large enough to like have representation or have a manager or like an agency represent me.
Justin: Um, but like I'm making money and like the fact that you helped me go like bridge this divide and make 10, 10, five, 10 X, what I making on an average deal that has changed my life, bro. I have, I can't tell you how hundreds of testimonials that I have video testimonials of people. Like I just got one from a creator named Molly.
Justin: She, she unboxed my book in her car and she was just like, dude, she was just like, I just got the book from Justin Moore's. I have to send it to you at some point, [00:17:00] but she was just like, Justin Moore helped me quit my bleepin job
Dustin: That's
Justin: and that's true. And that is a true statement. And so like, um, just like dude, like what is better than that?
Justin: And so I was like, yeah. Even though I, I saw those signals, I didn't know what the business model was going to be in the early days. I, I, because like no one I knew was just like doing sponsorship coaching. What the heck is that? Like there's literally no one. It was all managers. I had a bunch of friends were managers, agencies, all this stuff too.
Justin: But I was just like, there's got to be a more value aligned model where it's like. Uh, I'm not taking a cut cut of your deals like that, that I saw so much bad behavior with that where it's like because the manager, the representation of the creator, that's the only way that they were being compensated. I saw them steer people into deals that were not good for them because they needed to eat and they were like, Yeah, you should take the seal, take the seal like super high pressure.
Justin: Um, and I just saw so many horror stories of mice are personally, we had experiences like that ton of our friends, [00:18:00] um, and I was just like, there's got to be a better model. And so that was really. What I landed on was like, let me just educate you. You keep everything though, right? And so a lot of people were like, what's the catch?
Justin: Like, what's what percentage do you guys like? No catch. Like, I'll train you. I'll coach you. You do my course, whatever. Um, and you keep 100 percent of the upside. And so I think that that this model is really resonated with creators who are becoming more inherently suspicious with, like, believing that, like, Oh, there's like, uh, there's a gatekeeper.
Justin: Like, I have to get on the radar of, like, the gatekeeper who will help propel my career to the future. And when I'm telling people is like, there's no one coming to save you. It's you. You're the, you're the CEO of your business and you have to be
Dustin: I love that. Yeah. And like the, the parallel that comes to mind is sort of like financial services. You, you're basically like a fiduciary fee for service. Hey, I come in and tell you like which things to invest in because it's in your best interest and I get paid. My fee, regardless of what action you take versus you really should be in this fund because they pay me 1.
Dustin: 5%. This only pays [00:19:00] me one and a quarter and I'm going to kind of turn a blind eye to your best interest. So I love that. So it sounds like it allows you to serve in a more authentic way. You see, uh, exponential impact when you kind of give the freedom to their creator to make better choices and be you.
Dustin: Self reliant and self educated. Um, so the impact side of this equation makes a ton of sense. Just sort of, you know, keep in mind, we're talking entrepreneurs who are thinking about their own offers and maybe they feel stuck in a model that doesn't feel as authentic. What's the difference for you? Like, I mean, do you feel like there's a bigger upside here versus, because it
sounds like the agency was the easier initial choice because you knew the model, it was working, it's what everyone else kind of does, people get it immediately, yet driven by this, uh, this, this.
Dustin: You know, desire to serve in a bigger way, totally respect that. And on the other side, does it serve you better, I guess, just to put it point blank,
Justin: in the short term when I chose this business model. It was not obvious that [00:20:00] it would, it would serve me in the long run. I was actually like foregoing way more money, actually not with the agency model, but people asking me to represent them. So I could have been a
Dustin: agent model,
Justin: I'm gonna be an agent now.
Justin: I'm gonna represent people. And yeah, I'll do the same model that everyone does. And I had people who were doing six figure sponsorships in my inbox begging me to represent them. Okay. You know, ongoing. So it was like in the short term, I could have just been like, all right, let's go short term win for myself.
Justin: But again, I had this strong conviction that like this is not a good model, fundamentally not a good model. And yes, in the short run, I have, I will not have the upside. I'm not participating in the upside of these creators. But again, I just feel like the message and the impact that I can just basically start beating the drum about this over time.
Justin: Perhaps there will be a long term Side benefit to me. But again, like I've always believed that like personal success is a byproduct of service. And so I've always been [00:21:00] way more comfortable focusing on my students and my client successes versus my own. You'll almost never see me flexing how much
money I'm making on the internet.
Justin: I've done it a few times, but like that, cause that's like a tried and true way to grow your business is
Dustin: works, but yeah,
Justin: K MRR. Like here's the 10 lessons in the thread boys on X or whatever. Um, but that's not usually I will, you know, almost always 90. 7 percent of the time, I'll almost always focus on my success stories and case studies and things
like that, because it's just what I'm comfortable doing, and I just think that in the long run, um, Like, yes, I think that there will be a long term positive benefit for me, but that's not why I'm doing it.
Dustin: I love that. Yeah. Because you could, you know, my mind always goes to the kind of business strategy, the short term, easy money, quote unquote, is yeah. Being in your, in your world, it seems like. The traditional model, be an agent, um, run an agency, whereas there's less immediate return as a coach, as a consultant, as someone who's sitting there as an advisor, um, however, you [00:22:00] know, longer term and now we're, you know, five years into this and now you've got a book and you're, you're, you're, and have a more mature model.
Dustin: And we can talk about the evolution of how you've done courses and coaching and cohorts and, you know, up into what you're doing today. I think it's starting to become pretty clear to me. Uh, and hopefully for you, you're starting to feel it and experience it. I think there's a bigger upside with this approach because it's, it's ultimately more scalable when you're in that advisory role and you're not tied to an X number of clients who.
Dustin: Your success is dependent on them, um, performing or maybe taking some deals that, that they otherwise wouldn't take. So I do, I I'm, I'm also of that heart that like. The way I succeed, I think in terms of 10 X, everything, right? So if you want a seven figure business, you need to have a seven figure impact on your clients.
Dustin: Uh, or an eight, I'm sorry. If you want to have a six figure business, you didn't have a seven figure impact on your clients, right? Your clients are making collectively. A million dollars and their unique zones of genius and the things that you help them with. You should earn, you know, 10 percent of that and you should get, you know, a six [00:23:00] figure business and seven figure business have an eight figure impact.
Dustin: And I've really seen that kind of play out in lots of different ways. So yeah, I appreciate you indulging me and kind of asking you a kind of a pointed question of what's in it for Justin, but I think you've expressed it really. Um, well rounded, uh, thoughtful approach to like why you're choosing the model you're choosing.
Justin: Let me share one more thing to bookend this, which I think is really important, which is that I also have evolved in my own life and personal journey of like, Man, I was really like hustle. Like I want to do the
entrepreneurial thing. And I was very much fixed on like making money and how do I succeed and all those things.
Justin: And you know, my wife and I have been blessed with so much success personally with our businesses and channels and things like that. But I don't know if this is the same way for you, dude. But like, as I get older, as my kids get older, I just start thinking like, what is my time on this planet? Like, what will it be for?
Justin: And uh, Um, I just start thinking more about these larger questions about legacy and about impact. [00:24:00] And what do I want to be known for? I've published thousands of YouTube videos over the years, thousands of social posts, newsletters, blog posts, whatever. But like, um, What will last? This is one of the reasons I wrote the book.
Justin: Candidly is like, you know, being able to just like hand someone that's like, here, this is everything I know about sponsorships. Here you go. And this is going to survive beyond me, hopefully. Right? And so again, I think, um, the answer also is like, uh, the answer has to come from like these larger questions that I'm pondering about my own existence.
Dustin: Yeah. I love that. And, uh, let's use that as the parlay into the book, because I think one of the reasons people write books when they write the right book and the book quote unquote, you know, hopefully you have a library of books by the time, um, you know, God calls you from the earth, but this first major book is.
Dustin: Planting a flag in the ground and creating a legacy. It really is. And so I think that legacy is an appropriate word. So loaded question. You probably been asked 100 times, but, you know, kind of knowing our audience legacy is obviously part of this. [00:25:00] I'm sure there's an aspect of business growth, lead generation, um, getting on bigger stages, things like that.
Dustin: But like, why did you write this book at some point? I guess maybe tell us like how the book came to be and why you decided to say, yeah, yeah. And this is the book. Like why this book? And why did you decide to do this right now?
Justin: well, first of all, I want to acknowledge folks that might be listening or watching who are just a bit skeptical and they might tune out now because they think like a sponsorships. Like I am a coach or I am a course creator or I'm a
speaker or an author. I don't do sponsorships. I'm not dancing on tick tock like I'm none of those things.
Justin: Um, Come back, come back to this tab, come back to your podcast player because I want you here because sponsorships are for you, Dustin said at the top of the call that he got sponsors for his live summit that he did recently too. So like there's a lot of we're going to talk about some various ways that non traditional creators or non traditional influencers can get sponsored because like I have my own business sponsored as a sponsorship coach.
Justin: How niche is that? So we can get it, we [00:26:00] can, we can get into some of the, some of, yeah, we can get into some of the inside baseball of course there, but I just wanted to like it. Pull some people back in who might be feeling, uh, drifting away. Um, so the, the, the real answer about why I wrote the book is let's just go back to first principles.
Justin: Like I, the way I started educating people was YouTube videos because that was like what my comfort zone, I consider myself a YouTuber first and foremost. That's how we came up. Um, and so I was like, okay, well that's how I learned. Let me like make some YouTube videos. Right. Um, and then people said, Hey, you've got some really interesting frameworks here.
Justin: Uh, I'd love to read more about them. I said, okay, well, let me take the transcripts and make some blog posts. And then someone said, well, I love reading these, but I'd love to get them like delivered to my inbox because I don't want to come back to your blog. I was like, okay, let me make a newsletter. And then someone said, oh, you know, I'd love to, like, listen to your live streams or your musings on my commute.
Justin: I said, okay, let me make a podcast. Right. And then so it was like I kept jumping to these content formats, but it was based in response to the learning styles that my audience. And customers were asking me for and so I was kind of building out the creator wizard cinematic universe, basically, and I was thinking, Okay, what's like, [00:27:00] what are the other two really big ways that people learn?
Justin: Number one is a book. They read books to learn things. They listen to books, things like that. So I probably should write the book about sponsorships because there really isn't one. Um, and you know what I also should do? I should probably have an in person event because a lot of people learn in person through facilitation and things like that.
Justin: And so I'm also launching an in person event soon. So, um, it was, it was as much driven by audience and customer demand as it was by this true desire. Like if I want to have the most impact possible, I need to permutate my knowledge and my frameworks and my strategies into as many content formats as possible.
Dustin: I love that. That's awesome. And see, I would love to get a little more into the substance for, for our market or our listeners. So I love that you led with. This isn't a discussion pointed at tick tockers, influencers, people who traditionally be like, I make my money from sponsorships. Right? Um, I've never had any sponsorships until recently.
Dustin: And I'd love to do a postmortem on the event that you mentioned here in a [00:28:00] moment. But like. Who can get sponsorships? I think a lot of our audience would say, Hey, I'm an expert. Maybe I'm like a health coach. I am. Um, you know, I have a podcast, but I'm a podcaster. I have a YouTube channel. I'm going to the YouTuber.
Dustin: Like, first and foremost, I'm an expert at business consulting, executive coaching, marriage coaching, you know, these like actual things that help people. And then the media is sort of a secondary means to get my message out. So It seems like that's kind of your, your bread and butter is like people who are identify as a creator more so than like an influencer is that accurate?
Dustin: And like, maybe start bringing us into this world of how those people us people can actually like use sponsorships. So I think a lot of people don't even see this as a possibility for the type of business they run.
Justin: let me answer this question by sharing a quick story. So I recently moved from California to Minnesota. Okay. And that was a big move. First of all, it was negative 10 degrees this morning. Um, that's how big it was. Um, and, um, I hired in the [00:29:00] early months of us moving in. I hired a handyman. To come and help with like odd jobs around the house, changing stuff around, painting, et cetera.
Justin: Um, and I was just telling him one day, I was like, man, I gotta, I gotta figure out my gutter situation before the winter. Like I gotta get these cleaned out or like get the traps over the gutters or whatever. Um, and he's like, oh, well, you know, I've been a handyman in this area for a really long time and there's only one company.
Justin: That you should hire to do this. Um, and they're, they're amazing. I know them. They're great people. Um, definitely call them. And I did not think twice. Dustin, I picked up the phone and I called this gutter company. They came out. They gave me a five figure freaking investment for like putting these gutters on gutter shields or whatever on gutter traps or whatever they're called.
Justin: Um, and um, isn't that interesting? That my handyman does not have a YouTube channel, right? He does not have, you know, like a newsletter or he's not a coach or whatever, but based on just a single word of mouth testimonial, I
potentially [00:30:00] am going to make a five figure investment into this company over here.
Justin: And so if we pulled that example to anyone listening or watching, I bet you that a lot of the people that you work with really take your recommendation seriously. So yeah, you may only work with five people. Or 10 people or 20 people or whatever it is, but you have significant influence over those people.
Justin: And so a big part of thinking about what a sponsorship would look like would be thinking, okay, what are the brands and companies and products and services that would absolutely die to get in front of my five or 10 coaching clients? There's probably let's let's talk about the real estate agent, let's say, right?
Justin: The person who, uh, you know, has influence in her local community or something like that. What would it look like for her to go to the local coffee shop chain with the three locations around her local metro and say, Hey, I would love to do a partnership, a sponsorship where I will come in and do some sessions for first time homebuyers in your [00:31:00] coffee shops.
Justin: I'll do it once a month. We will circulate it, will rotate it, whatever, um, I, you pay me to send out. Uh, this took blast to my list of 300 potential homebuyers. They'll bring them into your coffee shop. And oh, by the way, it would also be great if you could email your email list, coffee shop of 10, 000, you know, customers that you got from square or whatever, you know, uh, about these events as well.
Justin: Um, So first of all, there's a lot of really interesting things about this example, right? Which is like number one. Yeah, they probably are very interested in like, you know, tapping into this real estate agents, local community of like people to bring them foot traffic into their business. But wow, so exciting that this coffee shop gets to email their customer base, not about the new beans that they're featuring that month.
Justin: It's about this cool session, this webinar, not webinar, but like these in person sessions that they're doing with a local real estate agent. So it's like a win, win, win. Yeah. All around, right? And so, and money can absolutely exchange hands in these scenarios because it's so value aligned. And so again, just like extrapolate this, these examples to your own business, [00:32:00] regardless of what you're doing.
Justin: Um, there are opportunities for you to just think creatively. And really at the end of the day, that's the number one theme in this book is like, how do we think creatively to ensure that I can help this business, this company, this brand accomplish a business outcome by partnering with me.
Dustin: that's beautiful. I love that. Yeah. And I talk a lot about partners. It was an aha moment as you were saying, like a little light bulb went off and I sort of got this and I want to ask you if it's an equal sign or if it's like one of those little squiggly, uh, similar to signs or whatever the math term is.
Dustin: Um, partnerships, sponsorships. So, cause you kind of started saying the word partner and then you stopped yourself and said sponsor. Is there a difference? So like, um, if you're going to partner with a brand and say, do this in person collaboration, like with the coffee shop example, or it might be a joint workshop.
Dustin: If you're doing the online example, um, you know, there's different monetization strategies around a partnership, revenue share, a affiliate commission prepayment for this. So sponsor mean. Pre pay or like what, what, how [00:33:00] do you, how do you juxtapose those two terms, sponsor and partner?
Justin: Yeah. So, um, when I think of a sponsorship, I think about three pricing models that I talk about in the book. So you've got the commission only or affiliate only model where you're only being compensated if there's some sort of action taking place like a sale, right? And you get a cut of that. There's a hybrid model where you actually get compensated a flat base fee Plus some sort of kicker commission on the back end, probably usually at a reduced lower rate.
Justin: Uh, and then there's a flat compensated partnership where the brand of the company is just paying you a flat amount for the privilege of getting in front of your audience or your customers or clients or whatever. Um, when I think about a partnership, um, yeah, sometimes I'll use it interchangeably. I mean, the, subtitle of the book is how to attract price and execute your dream brand partnerships, not sponsorships, right?
Justin: Um, but, um, At the end of the day, what I always come back to, dude, is like, okay, how can I make this a win for everyone involved for me, for the brand and for my audience? That's really what I care about is how do I engineer a win for [00:34:00] everyone involved? And so sometimes there may be situations where I willingly accept less money because it's just going to be better for all parties involved.
Justin: Heck, I can talk about right now how I'm trying to get my book sponsored. Dustin, which is like, Hey, let's think about my motivation right here. I just launched this book. I have a goal to get it in the hands of 100, 000 people in the next five years. How the heck am I going to do that? I can't do it on my own.
Justin: That's crazy. That's really hard to do, right? And I'm self published, right? And so my motivation right now is look, okay, in every interaction that I have with a brand or a company who's interested in tapping into my customer base of, you know, 35, 000 creators on my newsletter, how can I tap into their customer base of 100, 000 creators who I would love to hear about my book?
Justin: So I might. Negotiate some interesting deal structure where it's like, yeah, I could talk about you on my platforms on my newsletter. That's great. But like, hey, can we do a webinar together? Or hey, can you email your 100, 000 people about my book? Or hey, what if what if we do a special edition of my book where there's the brand little [00:35:00] seal on the cover here where it said brand XYZ edition and there's a forward from the CEO talking about why, you know, um, You're awesome and sponsorships are great.
Justin: If you use their email marketing platform or whatever, you can make more money in your business, right? Um, Hey, you could print 500 of these anytime you want and go distribute them at your local, yeah, your, you know, your trade show or your event or whatever you have to compensate me for the privilege of doing this special edition, of course, but like, think about how amazing this is.
Justin: It's value aligned. I get more. Distribution for the book. I get it in more people's hands. The brand of the company gets to act as an advocate. They are an advocate for the community by handing these out for free. Um, and I make
money because, you know, for the privilege of doing this sponsorship. So again, I keep going back to this idea about creativity, flexibility.
Justin: You know, you may have a way and where you have done sponsorships at some point, but it was like, here's packages. 4 5 pick one. That's what you
gave them a media kit or a proposal where it's like a prefix menu and they're like, okay, I guess One package, one, um, where it's like, no, throw that in the trash can.
Justin: Like, it's all about [00:36:00] understanding what the goals of the sponsor are and then steering them to what's going to help drive the needle, move the needle for them.
Dustin: That's super clarifying because I think a lot of people, one think sponsorships are for influencers, and two think sponsorships are, Hey, I clicked on this conference 'cause it said you wanna be a sponsor and had a 15,000, $10,005,000 package and I got a 10 by 10 booth, or I got my name, my logo on the screen.
Dustin: Those are sponsorships, but creators need creative sponsorships. And so, uh, be able to think through strategically who really wants access to my audience, even if it's a small niche audience. And then on the other side of this. Which audiences do I want access to, right, to sell my premium program, sell my book, um, you know, share, share my, my impactful message.
Dustin: So as we close up here, Justin, you know, a lot of my audience is either a podcaster or they use podcast guesting because, you know, that's the thing I do. Um, I'd love if you have any sort of nuance or niche examples or anything like that, like on either side of the microphone. Um, Most people, again, think podcaster, you're [00:37:00] Joe Rogan and you get paid on a CPM basis for X number of downloads.
Dustin: You get X dollars. That's traditional sort of media sponsorship. What are some other ways we can be thinking about sponsorships either as a guest or if we have a kind of a small niche podcast that people might want access to?
Justin: All right. So I've got a great example here. So one of my longest running coaching clients, his name is Paul Jamison. He runs a podcast called the green industry podcast. You're going to love this. And he teaches lawn care professionals. How to grow their business. He's doing. He's doing 120, 150, 000 downloads a month on his podcast.
Justin: So he is basically the key opinion leader in his very niche industry. And he is absolutely crushing it with brand partnerships. Because if you think about the tractor companies and the mowers and the hedge trimmers who aren't trying to get in front of the consumer. Who's shopping in Home Depot, they're trying
to get in front of the contractor, the professional who has a business to use their prosumer line of the mower or whatever, right?
Justin: The writing mower, et cetera. And so he's done a lot of yeah, [00:38:00] traditional type partnerships, like a podcast ad read, et cetera, et cetera. But like one of his most lucrative recent partnerships, and he's shared this, um, that we helped him land, um, is John Deere tractor. One of the largest tractor company in the world came to him and they said, Paul, um, would love to collaborate with you.
Justin: Let's talk. And so instead of him being like, okay, here's the five packages, pick one, you know, of like the podcast, ad reads and social media and all that stuff, too. He's like, let's hop on a phone call. I would love to learn more about what your objectives are, what's on the road map, etcetera, etcetera. And they said, well, thank you so much for asking this.
Justin: That that's, that's really cool. Um, you know what? Now that you say that, I know we were gonna, we came inbound for this, like, you know, podcast thing, but like, really, what's a big priority for us this year is the largest trade show of the year is happening in last October. It's called a quip and What would you think of podcasting live from the booth for the entire conference?
Justin: You can bring in your friends. You can interview them. You can interview people on our marketing team. All the press are going to be there. You know, you know, everyone who's important is going to be there. And we want you the [00:39:00] key opinion leader to be in our booth with the John Deere logo behind your head in all the videos and all the photos.
Justin: And Hey, we'll back up a dump truck full of money and drop it on your driveway. How does that, how does that, how does that sound? Um, So does that sound like a normal sponsorship, a normal social media integration or something doesn't know it doesn't it's it's understanding and aligning, uh, what the brands have budgets for this is what they don't have budgets to pay random people that reach out with their hands outstretched, they say, Hey, like, I see it's like you're trying to accomplish X, Y, Z, Z.
Justin: Yeah. What if we could do this thing over here? And then it's so much easier of a pitch for them internally to go to their superior, to their boss and say, Hey, we allocated 1, 000, 000 for this thing, this marketing campaign. If we pay Paul or if we pay Dustin 50K of this or 100K of this, he's going to get us closer to our goals.
Justin: And so this is the positioning exercise that you need to do when you're thinking about creating a sponsorship strategy.
Dustin: That's a beautiful example. Um, and I know you mostly live on the creator side of this [00:40:00] equation, right? So I have a niche audience. I have my newsletter. I have my podcast. I have my my niche media and I want to attract sponsorships, really valuable partnerships. My mind goes to promises. The last question before we talk about how people should go like by You know, maybe 5, 000 copies of your book to get you a
Justin: Bro, you just, you just wanted some free consulting. It's okay to admit it, man. Come on. It's okay.
Dustin: Let's take it. Yeah, um, I'll take it, but I'm thinking on the, so I'm a creator and I am very dialed in on who my ideal client is. Right. And I like to access niche audiences. can I act as a sponsor rear, I guess, sponsor, like, how can I be the sponsor? Like, how can I reach into those niche audiences in a creative way to form partnerships so I can get my, my creator message or my coaching or my book.
Dustin: Into those niche audiences run on the other side of that equation that also creates a win win win partnership. You have any thoughts on that
Justin: so, um, again, let's go back to the book example, right? Which is like, if you are approaching [00:41:00] A potential someone that you would like to sponsor or collaborate with, it's very important that you understand what is motivating and exciting them right now. A lot of brands and companies have shared this with me that like, man, it's just so hard to get the attention of someone who'd be like, take me seriously.
Justin: And a big part of it is like they may be making You know, 50, 000 a month on their coaching program or their course or something, and they don't want to bother with your 500 offer to like sponsor their podcast or whatever. It's just not worth the time for them. And so understanding the structure of their business and what they're paying attention to is so critical because you need to it.
Justin: craft a bespoke offer that will get them excited. So if a brand comes inbound to me, I'm going to pay a lot of attention to the brand that says, Hey, Justin, we, you know, we don't have a terribly huge budget. What we got this list of 10, 000 creators. We'd love to like, figure out a partnership. We'll talk about the book.
Justin: We'll pay you a little bit. We'll do this type of thing. And I'm like, Let's hop on a phone call. This is I super appreciate that. That's awesome. And so that is gonna be a way more effective strategy than trying to just like scattershot this
message to 100 people. Who's gonna take it? [00:42:00] You know, here's the offer any ticket or leave it this type of thing.
Justin: And so I think you're gonna just have a lot more success being mindful and thoughtful about forging some of these partnerships. It's less scalable, obviously. Um, but, uh, I think the, the, the fruit that you'll bear from, from that strategy is, is, uh, way more effective. And I do want to, before we wrap up, I do want to just like quickly comment on your event,
Dustin: Yeah, I did. I do want to get into that a little bit. You want me to give a little context
Justin: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Give me, give me the context. Cause maybe we could just like real quickly workshop it.
Dustin: Yeah. So I just had the pod profit summit. I would say it was a very successful event. It ballooned from an intent of like maybe 20 speakers to 39. It was, uh, it was an albatross, but it was amazing. So there's a lot of great lessons and I'll do a whole deep dive on that later. But part of this. Was I was encouraged to have sponsors.
Dustin: It's like, Hey, you're doing a podcast specific, uh, event for entrepreneurs. This is a really captive niche audience. We ended up with well over a thousand registrants. So it was, it was like a success from an attention grabbing standpoint. And [00:43:00] so anyway, that was a pretext. It was like, you should have sponsors.
Dustin: I'm like, okay, I've never done that. So what I do, I could J B C D E. And I had like this crazy wide range. I didn't really know what to put in each package. And at the end of the day, just to bury the lead on what I actually did. I ended up with five sponsors, two were less connected to me and we're, you know, lower dollar, easy sort of transactional things.
Dustin: Three, though, were more in depth. And as I reflected on why this works so well with those three, they're all clients of mine who had a deep level of trust, knew what I was about, and I love what they did. And it was very complimentary. And so. Um, it was a, give me money and then I'll do some special stuff.
Dustin: And of course I way over delivered for them and the exposure we gave them. So I kind of feel like it kind of worked, but like, I kind of also left a lot of meat on the bone cause I don't know what I was doing. And it even left me questioning at the end of the day, should I have just forgot the whole sponsor thing?
Dustin: Did it just add a layer of complexity to an already complex event? So that is what I did with the summit that ended literally last week as we record this, and I haven't done a full postmortem on it, but I'd love Justin your, [00:44:00] your insights and what I could have done better.
Justin: All right. So I want to first acknowledge you, uh, about feeling as though kind of lost. Like, I don't know what to put in these packages. I don't know how much to price. Like, dude, we like, we didn't go to school for this stuff. No one sat us down and like taught us like how to wheel and deal, you know, especially candidly, man, if you grew up in a family where money was like taboo to discuss or it was money was tight.
Justin: And so like the idea about it. Advocating for your own for your worth. And like, who am I to like ask for this amount of money? There's a lot of imposter syndrome. So see a lot of head junk that I've I often have to unwind with a lot of my coaching clients. Um, so I just want to acknowledge you there that that's like a very, very normal thing, dude.
Justin: Um, On the topic of like, is this even a worthwhile thing to do? Given the hassle I have this, um, framework that I call audience first offers. So at the end of the day, it's not really about you, dude. At the end of the day, it's about how do I most capably serve my That's Audience [00:45:00] slash customers.
And so a big exercise that I encourage people to do is some psychographic research surveys where you actually send out soliciting feedback like, Hey, I want to learn more about you.
Justin: I'm planning out my next, you know, podcast plan for 2025. Like I want to learn more about you. I can see roughly in my podcast player like your ages and your geography and genders and all that. But like I want to know more about you. Like what types of jobs do you have? Are you married? Do you have kids?
Justin: Like what's keeping you up at night? What problems do you have? Um, and when you ascertain this type of information, you start to realize like, well, there's actually three buckets of ways that I should be able to serve these people.
So the first is where you live right now, Dustin, which is products. I call it your PSA products is peace.
Justin: So it's like the things that I'm directly selling to my audience, right? Courses, coaching books, speaking engagements, whatever, right? Um, because yes, I'm going to help them with this acute issue of this problem that they're having. Sure. Sounds good. I'll do that all day long. The S in PSA is your sponsors and you start to realize like, wow, I'm starting to get a lot of this feedback [00:46:00] from my audience that like they're having this active issue in their business with, I don't know, recruiting and you're like, well, I don't, I'm not going to make a course about that or like coaching because that's not my expertise, but they're having this active issue.
Justin: They just told you 25 percent of respondents. Maybe I should go out there and hire a. Software that helps you with recruiting or helps you with, you know, retention or employee portal or whatever. Like again, it's not about you, bro. It's about serving them and helping make their lives and businesses better.
Justin: The last bucket is a in the PSA is your alliances. So this is where they're saying, Hey, I'm running this business, but my marriage is suffering. Because I'm working constantly and you're like, well, I don't really have a therapy or I'm not really doing that type of coaching, but you know what? I have a friend who's a, who's a marriage family therapist and they're amazing at this stuff.
Justin: I better put them and their contact information in front of my audience because you know, if your marriage is suffering at home, you're not going to be your full self and capable self in your business, right? And so. A lot of people are terrified of taking this [00:47:00] approach, though, because they think if I put someone else's offer in front of my audience and they buy it, they're not going to have money to buy my coaching program, which is a scarcity mindset view.
Justin: There is infinite amount of money in this universe. And if you come at it from a service perspective, when that person's life is made more whole, By working with your friend or working with the sponsor or whatever, they're now going to look at you so much more favorably. They're going to think, wow, Dustin is the person who introduced me to this brand or this other coach or whatever.
Justin: And now I finally feel like I'm ready to invest in his coaching program. So the buried lead here is that you'll actually make more money in the end.
Dustin: That's awesome. I'm glad we ended with that. Not only for the free consulting, but I think that PSA framework. So your product, of course, you got to think about that. The sponsors. And I think I really liked the alliances. Like. What are these upstream downstream sort of like things that cause people to come to me and then when they get success with me, what downstream issues does that cause?
Dustin: Right? And so, like, I, I'm fortunate to, like, have a whole community of people that we work with who are all these different areas of expertise. So those connections, those alliances happened very [00:48:00] organically. And in hindsight, that's kind of what happened with the, with the summit, you know, like the three major sponsors.
Dustin: One's a podcast producer. He produces this podcast. I have no interest in it. Being a podcast producer, dude, I'm the guest guy. Right? And so that was a very complimentary when people are like, well, what about how am I your own podcast? When you start the Hector, uh, two was a VA service and it's the VA service I use.
Dustin: And so the problem I create when people are successful with me is they have too many leads, uh, they have too much. Activity and like stuff to keep up with, they become the bottleneck in their business. So a VA is part of that solution. And then the third, uh, is basically, uh, someone who does systems and she does like click up project management systems for creators.
Dustin: And so she was a very natural sponsor. Cause I'm like, Natalie saved my life by. Helping me remove the bottlenecks in my business and my VA service better than rich did. And then Hector is my podcast producer. So it just sort of kind of worked out probably because of the things you shared that those became the three premier sponsors.
Dustin: It's purely collaborative. Uh, and like my audience is perfect for them. [00:49:00] And like, I can not only endorse them because I've used all of them and they're awesome, but then they, honestly, they endorsed me just as much by being like, Hey, you should work. I was in Dustin's program. It's been awesome. And so it was very complimentary.
Dustin: Partnership, even though they paid me for the exposure, right. As part of that, um, that setup. So very insightful, Justin, a final words on that before we tell people what to do next.
Justin: I mean, I think that the book end to this whole thing is that like, it doesn't always have to mean that there's money exchanging hands, like you don't always have to have an affiliate link for an alliance or whatever. It's just be like, no, be a good human and just send them down the road to this person who can help them improve their life.
Justin: And I just, I don't know if anyone believes in karma here, but I absolutely do. Like this, this being a good human, being empathetic, just, it all comes back around in the end.
Dustin: yes, and we talk all the time, all the time about planting seeds, planting relational seeds. Right? And you can do that very practically in something like a podcast guest. But ultimately, it's about being of service, giving 1st, looking for
a win for the other person 1st. And just know that the law of reciprocity, whether you think that's a God, the universe, [00:50:00] karma, whatever you want to call it, it.
Dustin: Is real and it works and, uh, serving first, giving first is like a universal principle. And if you do that in your business, it's going to set you up for a lot of success. So Justin has come here, been extremely gracious and given a lot, uh, for way longer than we agreed to. So I really appreciate that. Um, so tell us about where can they go buy the book or bunches of books, or if they want to talk to you about sponsorship coaching, like what's the next best step, Justin, for people to get over in your world.
Justin: Dude, that's so kind of you to have me on here. I super appreciate it. This is such a great conversation. And honestly, I love these specific types of conversations because, um, You know, if I'm able to even change one person's mind about whether sponsorships can be valuable for them in their business, I just get goosebumps thinking about that type of stuff, man.
Justin: So, uh, really appreciate you inviting me here. Um, Sponsormagnet. com is the best place to grab the book. Um, and I wasn't planning on doing this, but like if you want to YOLO, And literally buy 50 copies of the book. I will come and speak to your private community. If you, if anyone's listening that has like a coaching program or a [00:51:00] community or something, um, I actually don't even have that as like an option on that, but there's a way to, there's a way to like check out on the, or to send a contact form message.
Justin: Uh, so if you hear this and you're like, I was listening to seven figure leap, I was listening to Dustin. I want to take you up on that. Uh, I'll send, I'll
create a custom stripe link for you and we'll make it happen. Um, and, um, yeah, sponsor magnets. com.
Dustin: Sponsormagnet. com. Nice, clean, easy call to action guys. Um, I'm not going to pretend I read the whole thing. I did get about halfway through it because I just got this recently. Uh, it is honestly kind of blown my mind, opened my mind. You saw some of that in the conversation today. And so if you're in this world of. Sponsor curious, or maybe you've done some sponsorship stuff and it never felt quite felt right. Like Justin is very different in the space, as you've heard, as we've, we've unpacked for the last 50 minutes. So, uh, Justin, you're a gift, man. I can't wait to hang out again in person very soon. Maybe we'll be back in Boise, uh, here in a few months.
Dustin: Uh, and yeah, I'm really grateful to get to know you, get to learn from you today and sponsor magnet. com is the place to go. [00:52:00] Uh, go get your books, go get 50 of them and get, uh, get Justin as part of your private coaching experience for your clients. So thanks again, brother, for being here.
Justin: Thanks again, man