From Startup to Seven Figures: How Corporate Coaching Fuels Growth

Julia: I'd like to be doing three years time shooting for kind of that seven figure mark. So let's say around a million plus, ideally in profit,
Julia: I would ideally like to be actually serving clients
Julia: and working on the business in sort of a, a part-time capacity, , Dustin: but could it really work for a B2B application?
Dustin: one good strategic partner could give you all the business, you could handle,
Dustin: how do we find that strategic partner?
Dustin: (interview) Welcome back to the Seven Figure Leap. I am really excited today I get to spend time with Julia Nar, and Julia is an executive leadership coach and we're gonna do one of [00:01:00] our podcast coaching series here where we're gonna talk about Julia's current business, her goals, and hopefully come up with a really effective marketing strategy that can help her grow her impact and grow her income.
Dustin: the reason I wanted Julia to be in this seat with me is a couple reasons. One, it's a newer business. I think that's gonna be a lot of fun. A lot of the people we've, coached so far have had more established businesses and, this is newer. And also she's really focused on a B2B sort of corporate market.
Dustin: And I hear a lot from people that are. Hey, podcast guesting works great for meat sticks or consumer, you know, B2C coaching, that sort of stuff, but could it really work for a B2B application? So, we're gonna find out together because we're gonna go through a strategy session here with Julia.
Dustin: So Julia, thanks so much for being here. I'd love to just kind of turn the mic over to you for a few minutes and let you give some background and context for, who you are and kind of how you ended up, here today and, what your business looks like today.
Julia: Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for having me, Dustin. so a quick little snippet on my background. my name is Julia and, [00:02:00] through my newly founded company Corp Leadership, I'm really assisting, clients in that larger corporate space with executive leadership coaching. And I came to starting this business from really having had a strong coaching and sales background.
Julia: I've actually worked, across multiple different industries, different types of coaching over the years, even with clients all over the world. So I've had kind of my hands in a lot of different areas and the specific sort of problems that I usually am tackling with these leaders in my practice now are.
Julia: Around large transitions that they're making. And I'm sure anybody listening knows that, you know, the world, the economy, there's a lot in flux right now. but especially with large companies, they're looking at, as they may be going through cultural shifts, getting new leadership, going through, putting out new [00:03:00] initiatives or figuring out how they're transitioning their businesses.
Julia: The leaders in charge of those initiatives, really often find that there's, there's a lot of inner work as well as combining that with figuring out in those strategies, how do they best navigate that and get all their teams working together well on those points. so that's what kind of brought me to focusing in on that area in business is because there.
Julia: Are big problems that don't always have easy answers, which is really fun to dive into into
Julia: coaching.
Dustin: I love that. Well, that's great context. So coaching, sales, currently focused executive leadership, specifically leaders who are probably already experiencing or they know they're facing some significant changes. and you had some great examples, changing culture, changing leadership outside of them, or maybe they've been promoted into a new role, I would think technology plays into this ai all that good stuff.
Dustin: And so this leader is sort of in this [00:04:00] turmoil and in this place where they want to step into a new level of ability and leadership and confidence, and they need inner work. They need the ability to manage their team better. Like we, we kind of got this, that a good gist of sort of like the soup that you're playing in here.
Dustin: So
Julia: Absolutely, absolutely.
Dustin: Perfect. Well, I know it's a new business and so that's awesome. That's one of the reasons I wanted to dive in with you. But I would love to still, Get a snapshot of today, sort of like I have one client, I haven't got any clients yet. and I really, really want to get to is sort of an idea of where you're pointing your efforts.
Dustin: how do you deliver value? You know, is it one-on-one coaching? Is it in corporate workshops? Is it, you know, those sort of questions. Just to sort of get some context around, as far as you know, right now in this stage of the business, how would you describe your business model and your kind of starting point here?
Julia: Yeah, absolutely. So right now I'm strictly focused on just building up the client base through one-on-one engagements. so started working with a first couple of clients in that and really looking at [00:05:00] growing that, and in a sustainable manner as well.
Dustin: Yeah. You don't have to disclose anything, but it might help for context, like is this like, Hey, it's one one-on-one coaching session and it's 50 bucks, or is this like, Hey, there's a six month agreement and it's 50,000. Like just some context around kind of the size of the engagement that you're looking at right now?
Julia: Yeah, absolutely. So, because my focus is in the larger companies, as far as kind of the pricing model goes, it's a little bit of, in that initial discovery when I'm talking to a company, we establish like, what are their goals, if there are specific revenue targets or kind of more sales oriented goals that the company has, then we look at, you know, how the addition of coaching would impact that.
Julia: so it's kind of an equation on, determining there what those contracts come to. but usually in the kind of nuts and bolts of delivering that. I would focus on, at a minimum, usually around a [00:06:00] three month package of sorts, or could also be six months to a year, for, bigger change management efforts and things like that.
Julia: but usually I would say it would be, you know, weekly sessions that we'd be doing, but at least for a few months timeframe, just to make sure that, people
are getting really the results they achieve. Kind of similarly, I think, to what you could think of, with, fitness and training and things like that.
Julia: You wouldn't expect to go to the gym one time and get all the results that you're looking for magically in one hour. So, similarly there, I'd say, I would give a minimum of kind of three months of weekly work to at least start to, really see the impact of that.
Dustin: Perfect. Who hires you and pays you. and I know that maybe sounds like a pointy question, but is it the leader themselves and they're like, Hey, I found Julia. I'm gonna like go get money outta my bank account, and do this
personally, or that person's like, I really want some help. I have a budget in my department and I'm gonna use professional development dollars.
Dustin: Or is [00:07:00] it their boss, the CEO, the h HR director, you know, like who do you have to sell to in order to, start an engagement?
Julia: Yeah, absolutely. And I think, Dustin, this is where a little bit of the, the tricky part comes in dealing with larger companies because it isn't always so clear cut, or it may also be multiple decision makers who are involved in that process. So I may be coaching an individual leader, like a head of a department or some type of leader in actually delivering that coaching service.
Julia: But the sponsor or the person signing the check, for example, could be, more like a head of HR or learning and development department, or that could also be in combination with, the coachees particular manager or boss, that they have, you know, professional development goals they're looking for them.
Julia: so they might be kind of the decision maker, but then the person I'm working with the end client, that I'm directly working with might be different than the person [00:08:00] actually, signing up for it.
Dustin: Yeah, that makes total sense. Very common. and so as a standard, assumption or rule or whatever, it's, a company's paying for this, but often the person who's signing the checks and finding the budget for this is not the recipient who's actually on the one-on-one engagement with you. It's someone else in the organization.
Dustin: Is that fair? I'm gonna keep going, but,
Julia: Yeah. And, sometimes there may be that overlap just depending on where that particular leader is in the organization. But if, for example, it's
someone who's just moved up into management or they may not have as much of, the budgetary authority, then we may need to kind of loop in HR and other folks as well, to actually make it happen.
Dustin: And I know we have a limited sample size, but. Given that, there's a secondary question of who should I guess, find you and actually like, decide they want this help? and so, I've worked with people in these scenarios where
it's the individual leader and they're [00:09:00] like, I heard Julia at a conference or on a podcast or whatever.
Dustin: I'm like, I'm in this transition. This is something I really need. And then they go to their boss or they go to their budget or however that works, and they find the money, but they're really the, they're the instigator, I guess. And someone else is signing the check. Someone else has to approve it. The reverse, which actually someone that was a recent, a coaching series, in this scenario, very different dynamic where.
Dustin: The recipient wasn't necessarily seeking help, it was more like their boss saying, Hey, you're in a new role. Or, you know, even a performance improvement plan sort of situation where, hey, you need some support and here's the support. You didn't ask for it, but here's Julia. and I know it could be, you know, shades of either, but at least in your experience or maybe even in your preference, who's like desiring and making this decision that someone needs the help.
Julia: I think there's the one part of, you know, the company kind of recognizing that that leader may need help, because of the company already recognizes that coaching could be the solution we're [00:10:00] looking for. then there's that part of, like, the awareness of the problem may already be solved, but ideally the actual person being coached that leader, would also be really integral because, you know, there's always. And I'm sure you know this, Dustin, from anybody, receiving a service, that coachee would actually be the one going through the coaching, implementing, you know, the steps to make the changes that they wanna see. And so, you know, they would also have to show up and, be accountable to receiving that coaching in order to see results.
Julia: Otherwise, they'd kind of be dragged along, maybe by, by their boss, but without actually seeing, the difference. So we definitely want them to kind of be bought in, on that accountability aspect.
Dustin: Okay. So to sort of give. Concrete examples. It could be Joe, the leader is like encounters you and hears you speak and is like, this is actually something
I could really use help with. He's not going to his personal bank account, but he's gonna go to his organization and say, will you pay for this [00:11:00] coaching?
Dustin: I want it. That's scenario one. Scenario two could be a director of HR who meets you and is like, we have three people in the organization who are, we've put them in these big transitions, they really need support. we're going to effectively sponsor, this service and bring Julie in to work with these three people individually.
Dustin: So both of those would be, realistic scenarios for how someone discovers you and engages you. The payments are still coming from the organization. The recipient is into it, and they're, still the leader themselves. But if you could be discovered by either party. Is that fair?
Julia: Right. Exactly.
Dustin: Cool.
Dustin: I'm thinking through, you know, sort of my marketing lens of like, who is the hero here? Like, who is Julia, the guide to, in both the purchasing decision and in the, coaching work itself. So that's super helpful. I think we've got a really good feel, or I have a good feel for the current status of the company.
Dustin: One-on-one coaching, three to 12 months. you're working with the leader directly. They could be seeking help or someone in the organization could recognize that they need this help and sponsoring them, but either way, they're super [00:12:00] engaged and ready to level up their game and they are open to executive leadership coaching.
Dustin: So that's today's business. and now let's gonna put our, futuristic hat on and, talk about like, let's say three years from now. Where you can actually think about or describe revenue team size, like how many clients are you working with at a time? Those sort of things. Like paint a vision for me around your three year vision and, if it's easier for you to start with sort of like the personal boundaries of like, Hey, I don't wanna work one day a week, or I wanna work a hundred hours a week, or I want to travel.
Dustin: You know, all these things obviously play into this. So whatever context you want to give is great, but really what I wanna get at is like, what's the three year business model?
Julia: Yeah, absolutely. So I would say if I kind of paint that picture of three years from now, I'll start with revenue. ideally I'd, like to be doing three years time shooting for kind of that seven figure mark. So let's say around a million plus, ideally in profit, not just the revenues, but, working up to that.
Julia: I would say that would be [00:13:00] ideal, but really just as important to me is, kind of building a business in alignment with, my values and, having part of that looks like also time freedom. So I would ideally like to be actually serving clients
Julia: and working on the business in sort of a, a part-time capacity, , if you will.
Julia: and freedom is, a really core value of mine and is something that I've, intentionally, you know, kind of looked at entrepreneurship, as a way to help fulfill, because I know that I've had great jobs, where I've been able to actually have a lot of autonomy and, and a lot of freedom before.
Julia: But ultimately when it's not yours, there are certain. Things that you have to still abide by. and so that's my motivation to go into business was to look at, well, you know, if it is mine, then ultimately I'll be the one to make those decisions, for
Julia: myself.
Dustin: That's awesome. I think a lot of people listening, will resonate with that. I resonate heavily [00:14:00] with that, that's the same, a lot of the same values I hold as well. and so when we think about, let's just call it a million dollars, won't worry about revenue or profit for now, but it's a million dollar business.
Dustin: You're effectively working part-time hours. I think it's safe to say you don't get there with one-on-one coaching unless you're charging a lot of money for it, because you know, you don't have so many hours to deliver that. And to get to a million is a lot of dollars per engagement if it's all one-on-one.
Dustin: So. What do you think, this model evolves into? Like how do you see a million dollar business with you working the hours you wanna work structured, three years from now?
Julia: Yeah. So, I've thought about this and I think for this particular market, it would look like, you know, today that might look like me directly working with
clients and delivering those services. But as I grow, I could see really bringing on, more of a team of coaches on, let's say a contract basis.
Julia: So, accompanying other coaches who could also work with clients, and ideally those who have [00:15:00] different specialties to myself and different areas of, of expertise as well. So that as a company, we're able to offer, really a
broad, you know, amount of, services and handle different kinds of clientele, but that I would have, that team to expand the delivery. Capacities there Beyond myself.
Dustin: Okay. So do you still think it's all delivered one-on-one? It's just the time is dispersed from not just Julia doing it, but a team of people who are all doing one-on-one and your revenue is a reflection of the collection of those efforts. Or do you think you get into to, fractional embedded work or workshop work or group coaching?
Dustin: You know, there's different ways to scale a coaching business, but, what are your thoughts at least sitting here today with your crystal ball?
Julia: well I could see, you know, maybe some kind of incorporation with some group models or different kinds of, you know, training and things like that. I know that, I've been involved with providing training in my own [00:16:00] background before, which, is very interesting at this point in time because with everything happening with ai, I think we'll be. if we are having this conversation another year or two, things might look very different in that space, to see how that impacts, that kind of area. but I, I see a lot of, like, there's a lot of overlap between just directly doing coaching to leadership development programs that also are providing training on like specific skills that that leader might need to develop.
Julia: and they kind of go hand in hand, I would say. So probably adding in a bit more of that as well.
Dustin: Okay, so probably elements of group training or group coaching training program so we could scale in one to many in the way that we are delivering value. Also, you could scale the one-to-one by having people not name Julia actually delivering coaching. Sounds like you'd still be doing some of the coaching.
Dustin: Maybe you're kind of the top tier available coach for sort of VIP clients. Is that starting to get [00:17:00] around, a structure that you could get excited about?
Julia: Absolutely. Yeah. and one thing that I think is a model that is a, sometimes a little bit different from selling, let's say like a software or something like that to, more of a coaching can feel very personalized depending on, you know, who you're working with. is looking at that sales aspect of to what point, you know, now I may be doing the sales myself and also delivering the service.
Julia: and can some of that be shifted as I grow? or would I still sort of need to be involved on the sales side to some extent? as the owner of the company,
Dustin: That's actually exactly where I was going next is
Dustin: we've got our conceptual three year, team. So it's your business, your team, corporate leadership.com is rocking. you've got clients and, At some point you get to choose, which is the good news. maybe the, scary news is you will eventually need to choose, and you have to choose today.
Dustin: But, it does start to [00:18:00] set up sort of a longer term vision for marketing strategy. And the question on the table is what hats do you wanna wear in that scenario, right? Like you could very much be the rainmaker and basically you're the face of the brand. You're a thought leader, you're doing the
speaking and all that on behalf of your company, and you do very little, if any.
Dustin: Implementation or delivery, right? Like coaching. it could be that you love coaching, you actually spend most of your time on coaching and you have a different person who's the business development arm, you know, by commissioner or contract or partnership or however that would look. you know, there's different ways to make this happen, and I could, we don't need to get into it, but I can think off the top of my head of five different versions of this for $10 million, $15 million companies that I'm aware of.
Dustin: and so again, you get to choose, but like, when you think about in a million dollar business that you own and you've got a team of people available to you, which hats do you, wanna like, take off and make sure other people are wearing? And which ones are you? Like, I would really love to just be wearing this one or two or three hats, as your sort of identity as the owner of the business.
Julia: I'll say [00:19:00] the, passions and the hats that I love to wear first, Dustin are, one in the actual coaching. So,
Julia: I've been, in coaching for a while and delivering that. I think I would still love to be involved in and to some capacity, so staying there. also to some extent in maybe what might look like marketing.
Julia: And I know we're talking about podcasts specifically today, or some sort of speaking. that's something that just lights me up. And I, you know, having conversations like this, I, I really love so. I am definitely open to continuing to do that. I think more of the, the sales kind of, closing the deals, getting the contract signed, those logistics, and kind of the business development systems, are something that I would like to ideally have someone else doing, have systems, working for that.
Julia: and one thing I'm, I'm very aware of is, I know that in a lot of these type of businesses, there is, you know, especially in the early days, a lot coming in [00:20:00] by way of referral or kind of going out there and drumming up business. but that is not always sustainable. And so I'm very aware that the importance of building those systems to get things generating on a consistent basis is going to be very important.
Julia: And, I know that it's important. I can't necessarily say that's my greatest strength. So, probably looking at bringing on more support in those areas, to kind of get those backend pieces working. will be something I, I'd be looking at offloading a little bit more.
Dustin: Perfect. I love that. So what I heard in that sort of reflecting back to you is the things you don't want to do are all the coaching. because that wouldn't be a million dollar business. You don't want to do operations, you don't wanna be responsible for closing sales. you know, I would assume kind of in that finance administration, the sort of like back office things are not where you wanna spend your, hours.
Dustin: What you do wanna do is what I [00:21:00] would call thought leadership. So you are a coach and that could be coaching in public, that could be taking on just VIP clients. that sort of is a waterfall effect where you come and coach the CEO, but then they're like, we need your company to come fix our whole leadership team.
Dustin: And that becomes a, you know, multi-six figure sort of contract. so that's more of a sales through delivery in a sense, right? Where you are very influential in, the change that you're able to make and that generates very high quality referrals. but the other thing you said you love podcasting.
Dustin: I assume maybe by extension, do you see yourself speaking from physical stages as well?
Julia: Yeah, a little bit physical, and definitely virtual. I think that there's, so much opportunity with that. I've personally worked virtually for a long time and, sometimes it can be hard to kind of, you know, get up and get on the road through, flight delays and have to say goodbye to your family when you're, you know, oh, I've, I've got another work trip, coming up, so I don't mind a little bit of travel, but I wouldn't wanna be kind of [00:22:00] on the road all the time.
Dustin: Okay. For sales or delivery. so speaking at a major conference, going to do a VIP day with like a top tier client, that's gonna be a multi six figure sort of, like that's cool. But in effect what you're saying is it's a remote company, remote staff. You're not trying to like have a physical office that you have to be at all day and manage people hand to hand.
Dustin: And you're not looking to be a traveling spokesperson where you're on the road speaking all the time. 'cause those are options too. But kind of assume that 'cause time freedom was the number one value you talked about. do you see yourself like writing a book or anything along those lines at some point?
Julia: Yeah, I, think that could be, you know, kind of worked into the goals, at a certain point, just depending on what the, kind of, what the strategy is around that.
Julia:
Dustin: you're not, you know, signing a publishing contract today. It's more kind of the spirit of who is Julia, the head of a million dollar coaching company. Right? And like, and I think that's really important to sort of put some parameters on. [00:23:00] 'cause I think we make a lot of, I I would otherwise make a lot of assumptions.
Dustin: and you've already cleared up some things. And so the way I envision this future state is, and I'm gonna use my terms, but you know, you've built a marketing system, a marketing flywheel in effect, right? There are a. Technology systems, maybe people, but probably at least a person to do closing.
Dustin: But you have this like sales and marketing and sales engine, this flywheel that is constructed not necessarily through your own expertise, but in working with people who love that, like me or or other people. Like I love that
part of this, stuff. But the important part I want to get to is you are a primary fuel source to keep that thing spinning, right?
Dustin: So you are the face of the company. It's effectively an extension of your personal brand. You are writing the books, doing the podcasting, doing the virtual training, some in-person speaking, and you're doing some high level coaching that sort of becomes. Both referrals and content and case studies and all those sort of things that feed into the [00:24:00] flywheel so that your company is continuing to get leads and they're getting converted without you having to do all the calls.
Dustin: And then other people are fulfilling the majority of what comes out the other side of the flywheel. Is that a fair summation of kind of like the big, picture business model and how your role in it.
Julia: Absolutely. I think he nailed it.
Dustin: good. All right. I love it. Well, you're my kind of people, so this is good. I love this is like who I like, to serve.
Dustin: So we're gonna transition now more into this marketing strategy. but a key part of that that we haven't really talked about too much. Is trying to get as clear as possible, today and then, you know, sort of by extension in three years. But, about the ICP, the ideal client profile, like, who is the person that you need
to be in front of and educating that's going to buy your coaching.
Dustin: and I like thinking about that in two ways that maybe make this a little easier for us to break down because this is really key, to any marketing effort, identity and intent. You may have heard me talk about this. I actually [00:25:00] did a whole episode about this at, at some point, but the short version is we know it's corporate, you know, and we know it's a leader within a corporation and either they or someone in their org chart who has influence is gonna pay for it.
Dustin: But that probably describes a billion companies, right? So, so we think of like identity. I guess the easiest place to start would be, are there certain industries? Are there certain sizes of corporations where you're like, that is where I want to focus my efforts.
Julia: Sure. Yeah. I would say, industry wise, a couple that kind of come to mind are in a little bit, I would say finance, financial services. I have some context there. So looking at, that as one potential area and alongside that sort of
professional services. So when I think of other type of, professionals who might be. Kind of referral partners or work with the same kind of companies that I'd be targeting might be, accountants and people in tax and,
Dustin: I wanna talk about referral partners for sure, but I want to kind of save that. let's try to limit [00:26:00] it. And I know, you're in an early stage now this will get way more clear as you actually get more clients and you're like, like that. Hated that. Love that. you know, but, financial services is an important that's one.
Dustin: But if we think about like, what's the name of the company? Not name, but what's the industry sector of the company, who you're actually gonna go do the work for? And of course we'll talk about partners that can get you in the door at those places. and you don't have to have a direct answer, but financial services.
Dustin: By that do you mean like banks, investment firms. Like expand a little bit on financial services and then if there are a couple other sectors that you're like, yeah, these are kind of my people. I know that I would have fun working in those environments. Are there other ones that come to mind?
Julia: Yeah, exactly. So I think of, banks, you mentioned banks, investment firms, could be like insurance as well as is pretty big. and really I think the size of the company you mentioned would be pretty key. So if I'm thinking about the type of company that would have, multiple layers of leadership and multiple people even there who would be [00:27:00] potential clients, they'd probably be around that. Say 1000 plus count, let's say employee count. so I'm thinking pretty large companies, that would also have, you know, budgets kind of allocated towards things like professional development, and those kind of initiatives. I know when we, talk corporate, people usually think like publicly traded companies.
Julia: They could also be private as well, because I know there are some, like, fastest growing like Inc 5,000 type of companies that are privately held, but they're pretty large as well.
Dustin: Yeah. Okay. That's really good. So a thousand employee up, multiple layers of leadership. They have professional development budgets. one potential one would be financial services, banks, investment insurance. one thing you said I think is really key, is an ideal client for you would have the opportunity for you to coach multiple people in, in the same company, and I guess potentially also at the same time.
Dustin: Right.
Julia: Yeah, and I think even like, [00:28:00] as a means of kind of expanding out, let's say I were to work with a few leaders on a team in one department, and, you know, they see results or they, they like the experience they've had, we could, you know, bring that to another department within the same organization.
Julia: So even if it's. One, I may be working with the leaders over here on the finance team. they may say, okay, we actually would love you to work with our sales leaders over here, or our, you know, marketing team or that kind of thing as well. once they've kind of experienced.
Dustin: yeah, probably the way I would, I'm gonna write this down too, I'd call it external versus internal marketing, right? Like where it's like, where of this is getting, quote unquote your foot in the door, where, you know, and that's gonna be the heavier lift is getting established with one company, with the first client, where you're now part of their po sy, you know, their purchasing system and
you know, some people in there, right?
Dustin: And, from that, very importantly in, in the types of business you wanna serve, there's a super opportunity then to [00:29:00] grow from within where it's like. You go to the HR leader and, and you're like, Hey, this person's super happy. Their KPIs are up. what other departments should I be talking to?
Dustin: I would love to go do an internal training and show them what's possible, where you get internal advocates. In other words, by doing a good job. But I think that's a really smart strategy that we can be focused on, like external first. 'cause I'm sure that's what you thought about when you booked this, call, right?
Dustin: It's like, how do I get my foot in the door? And that's really important. We're definitely gonna talk more about that in the last 15 minutes here. But I think not to lose sight for you and for anyone listening in this environment where it's not just a one-off, you know, individual coach who's hiring you, and that's the whole opportunity.
Dustin: But you're in an organization sort of ripe with opportunity. And if one person's going through transition, there's probably a lot of other people going through transitions. And so how do we exponentially grow from within? And just always having an eye towards that and your positioning, your messaging, the documentation.
Dustin: Sort of internal case studies, you know, that sort of thing [00:30:00] where how do we, not only get in but then really expand the opportunity within each of these companies. And part of why that's matters to the external is we really wanna focus on opportunities that actually have that potential. So internal marketing would be really important. and I just made that up. I dunno if that's really the right term, but that's how I'm thinking about it. so let's go talk more about the external, which is kinda the meat and potatoes here. So we got a really good idea of the identity of these companies.
Dustin: Intent is more about what's the trigger? where are you meeting them in sort of the lifecycle of their leadership, I guess, in this case, to give a term to it, like the spectrum. and I think this can be really useful as a thought exercise to pick one of two lanes. 'cause I think otherwise this gets really diluted because.
Dustin: the way we've set it up, you really have two ideal clients from the sense of people who are gonna actually, you know, call you and say, I wanna hire you. we have the HR director who's like looking out at a big picture for the different people in the organization [00:31:00] who need leadership. And you have the leader themselves they're the ones actually knowing they need coaching. I think for the purposes of our time here, it'd be better to pick one of those two. 'cause I think we can get a lot more tactical and granular. I have a, thought, but I'd love to know your thought. Like what kind of jumps out to you?
Dustin: who should we be speaking to with our marketing at this stage?
Julia: I'm almost apt to say the, person, you know, the coachee, the person actually receiving the coaching because, you know, if they see the potential there and recognize that they could benefit from it, then I could see them actually being that helpful advocate to say, you know what? Let me loop you in with hr.
Julia: Let me bring in, whom you need to speak to to
Dustin: that's what I thought too. I didn't wanna prescribe that to you, but I think what would be cool is having our marketing strategy speak to the person who has the acute need for it. And that's our external marketing, at least the initial focus. Right? and then once we get that engagement, the internal marketing turns on, right?
Dustin: Where it's like, Hey, now [00:32:00] I need to not only develop a relationship with the person signing this check, or the HR director or the leader of this division or whatever, from the get go, from the start of that relationship, I
always wanna have a lens and be sort of, painting a picture for them about. If this goes well, here's other things I could be doing to have a ripple effect within your company.
Dustin: I'm not saying the first time you meet 'em, you're like, Hey, you're gonna give me 10 times what you just, you know, paid me. But they are the channel for what I've been calling internal marketing, right? So we get our foot in the door through the, per the coachee as you said it. we do a great job, obviously, and we have a lens toward not viewing them as a one-off opportunity, but how you can serve them and be a, demonstration to the other upper level leader to then make this a multi-client engagement.
Dustin: I think that's an important part of your business model really in three years and now, right? Like if you could have one company that kind of keeps you full now, like it really simplifies things. and then for that three year model, I [00:33:00] think the way you described it with your role, part-time hours, team, it seemed be a lot more efficient if you had.
Dustin: Five or 10 corporate clients and you're have an absor, an embedded relationship there where you're kind of constantly doing coaching, you're constantly developing internal training, and you kind of become an extension of their team in a deeper way. Does that kind of feel right?
Julia: I would say so, yeah.
Dustin: Yeah. And I know initially, I know this is sort of like setting up a dream scenario in three years, but, and right now you're probably, you know, what you've already been doing.
Dustin: It's like, I'll take a client where I can get 'em. and, it's always good to have a good intention for like what would come next if we go down this path. So where we're at now is internal marketing and discussion for another day. How do we like multiply the impact of every engagement? But for now we've got this leader in a corporation, a thousand more employees.
Dustin: I think it's really important before we talk and where we're gonna close with is more like the tactical plan. It's really important to identify. Their intent. In other words, what's the trigger? [00:34:00] What are the triggers? What are the things that are gonna make them be listening to a podcast seeking help hear you and be like, holy crap, I've been waiting for this.
Dustin: I need this. like in a very discreet way, what would be like the top three triggers that you think your ideal client would wanna raise their hand and be looking for your help?
Julia: Yeah, for sure. I would say, a lot of them are related to, there's these transition points. So one could be, that particular leader has. Been promoted up into, let's say their next level of management or leadership. And with that comes a new set of skills, a new even identity shift and in some cases that people need to make.
Julia: and that can be, challenging so that that new promotion could be one. another one could be on the company level. If there's new company leadership, like, a new CEOs come in or, at that very top C-suite level, that there's new leaders coming in. Often there's, a little bit of shakeup and some cultural shifts that happen with that, which ripples out [00:35:00] to everyone in the organization.
Julia: So, in that case, I would say the, directors or the kind of next level of leadership right below them on the executive level or VP level, might be needing some, support around how to kind of. Work through some of those changes happening. So that could be another point. And another one comes to mind is really on these large change management efforts.
Julia: So let's say that the company is trying to make a big shift, or we also say culturally, like if they acquire another company or they're merging, now you have two different cultures and two different companies coming together. inevitably there's going to have to be some, some things that have to be worked through in that process and that can get a little messy.
Julia: And so that's where something like having this executive coaching can really help to get everyone aligned,
Dustin: That's exactly where my mind was going was, you know, the first two things you said, I think we could, you know, there's totally the ability to [00:36:00] speak to people who just got promoted or speak to people who are working for a new CEO. But I think it was sort of like. The big one, the one the sort of nuclear bomb that gets set off that really makes people wanna get nervous and raise their hand.
Dustin: And, and it, it's like a new opportunity and there's fear and all this stuff. It, I think like mergers and acquisitions would be a really interesting trigger.
'cause if you can get in to an organization and help a key leader or couple key leaders in that transition, it's like, well now you're sort of like on the new team.
Dustin: It's like you're, you're like, you're the one who you're helping with the transition to make this work for everyone. And you mentioned acquisitions, but you know, mergers, acquisitions, obviously those happen all the time in banks, or investments or insurance, especially banks. It seems like every bank I know ends up with three different names.
Dustin: 'cause it changes every like 18 months 'cause they get bought out or they merged with another one. do you have any experience in that or is like, is that a useful, at least thought exercise of like. Focusing on serving leaders who are sort of middle [00:37:00] management and, and director level, preparing for during and after like acquisition or a merger.
Julia: Yeah. So I would say it's just an area that I've seen. I actually, have a friend who's working in a company that's literally going through this right now and just hearing her kind of tell me secondhand, like, well, we have, the way, you know, our values and the, our mission and the whole way that our company's operated.
Julia: Now they're joining with, a smaller company has, they're coming together, but they're not necessarily aligned in terms of the two different companies values and then how you have, employees and on each side, who are used to a certain way of doing things. And now. They have to figure out, how do we realign that and how do we move forward as one, in that fashion?
Julia: Yeah, I like it a lot. And again, I'm not prescribing this, but, and you could obviously take parallel examples and we could run with the strategy that, applies. But, but I like it for numerous reasons. For one, it's without a doubt a time of transition, for a lot of people. Two, it's [00:38:00] identifiable, right?
Dustin: Like you can see that someone's getting acquired or there's a news re a press release, or there's, you know, word travels pretty quickly whenever those sort of things happen. And an interesting idea would be focusing on being a. coaching resource for the like acquired leaders, right? Like a leader who is awesome at their job and they've been caught up in this merger acquisition.
Dustin: They want to thrive in this new environment, but they're coming from a different culture. And this new company has invested a ton to buy this company. the company is the people. And so they're sort of, and I'm sure they've
already hired the consultants to come up with the new tagline and the org chart and all that, but you're.
Dustin: This specialist who comes in and says, Hey, you just acquired this company. You've got amazing talent over here. And again, maybe you're talking to HR director, maybe you're meeting this acquired leader personally, but that these people need individual coaching. and I can sort of be the bridge between your company vision, your mission, helping them get on board and supporting them on a personal basis so [00:39:00] that they can feel not only comfortable, but they can really thrive in the new role, which is like a win-win win for everyone, right?
Dustin: It's like, good for the new company, it's good for the leader, obviously it's good for you. does that sound exciting? If you, had sort of this,
Dustin: niche,
Julia: Absolutely. I would even parlay it out to really any large scale change management efforts. Like let's say company is expanding into a new market, or they're, you know, they're making these, large shifts on an organizational level. Often what you see happen is just kind of an announcement of like, this is what's happening, and then everybody, like, fall in line and we'll make it happen.
Julia: but without realizing, you know, that change is, not easy and people often resisted it. and so there actually needs to be a thoughtful approach to that rollout and to helping people to adjust to it because just simply announcing it and telling everyone this is what's gonna happen, doesn't really help, productively with actually ensuring it's, it's rolled out successfully and that they do get [00:40:00] the intended results.
Julia: So,
Dustin: Yeah, and I think a powerful conversion mechanism, if you will, would be some sort of signature training that you can do, in these environments where you're, coming in and you're really talking about. How these changes, these change management, mergers, acquisitions, you know, whatever the things that fall under this umbrella, how that affects sort of frontline leaders, if that's the right term.
Dustin: But like how this is affecting your leaders, and what you can do about it. And then obviously one of the things you can do about it is invest in
coaching during this three to 12 month transition period to make sure that they are taken care of and thriving and bought into the new envision and all that stuff.
Dustin: So that's sort of an aside where yes, you can come in cold and get a contract with the company and say, come hire our director of marketing because we just acquired this company or whatever, and they're kind of lost. but also I think there's more of a proactive approach where you or partners, as we're gonna talk about here for the last couple minutes, say, Hey, we got this client, they're going through this thing.
Dustin: You guys are gonna need to talk to [00:41:00] Julia. She'll come in and do an amazing workshop. it'll be with your C-Suite team and directors or whatever. And what she can do is present. how to effectively navigate this change at the personal level for all these individual managers and leaders that are affected by it.
Dustin: And you know, if you want, she, this is what she does, she does coaching on it, but kind of step one is you can come in and do a workshop and educate them and let them know what's possible, right? And then I think that would be a super effective conversion mechanism, in this case. So in our last three to five minutes, that's how all these sessions have went by the way.
Dustin: It's like all about the structure, the vision, the offers, the ICP, the ideal client, and then we talk about the marketing, which actually to me starts to become fairly obvious. obviously podcast guessing we should talk about. and so we could definitely do podcast guessing that is targeted at that director of hr, you know, at that higher level person.
Dustin: But in this case, we're trying to meet these, leaders where they're at. And so there are lots of podcast interviews that would be attracting [00:42:00] people facing this change who are wanting to be better leaders. They wanna be more proactive, right? So, you probably know 'em better than me, but sort of HR podcasts, leadership podcasts would be a big category.
Dustin: and specifically about large scale change management or how to, grow when you're part of a merger and acquisition and, and like, have that be like the, topic that you come in and speak to on this kinda larger scale leadership, hr, management. those sort of podcasts where these leaders would proactively be listening 'cause they want that help.
Dustin: I think like, that seems pretty obvious. I think the key there to making this effective is having a signature message. And that's why I keep kind of going back to what's a trigger. There's lots of triggers, but what's like a trigger that you could own for five to 10 to 20 appearances where you're the like niche expert on this one thing that can come in and talk to this broader leadership podcast, this larger, HR podcast, those [00:43:00] sort of things. So, and, we don't have to define that one topic right now, but that start to feel more strategic and attainable if you're like, oh, I have like one signature talk, one signature teaching framework. That starts, if I have that as sort of my, leading edge, like that opens up a lot of these maybe what felt like a little bit of ambiguous sea of podcast opportunities where you can come in and actually plug into a lot of them because you have a niche topic to add.
Dustin: Does that make sense?
Julia: Yeah, I think so. So what I'm hearing is more of like, we look at targeting that, Corporate audience, those, those leaders, the type of podcasts they're listening to, but really speak more to those trigger point instances that they may be going through. So they see themselves in that
Dustin: Or even like a trigger point, like, hey, when your company is acquiring or being acquired, here's how this affects leaders on a personal basis. Right? And here's a framework for how to navigate that change as a leader.
Dustin: So if someone's listening to [00:44:00] that, they as the leader could kind of follow this framework and be like, oh, okay, I need to do A, B, C, D.
Dustin: and I, maybe I try to do it on my own, the HR director's like, oh, this sounds a lot like something we could pay money and solve for all these people we just acquired. Or, you know, or these people that are on our team that have, other people at their organizational level.
Dustin: And that creates conflict and uncertainty and everyone's wondering who's getting fired or whatever. So I think it speaks to both the HR and the individual leader. And I think the key to making it effective, because it's a massive market, there's a ton of podcasts, is to lead with one signature framework for one sort of signature event or signature transition point, if that makes sense.
Dustin: Right. I'm picking on mergers and acquisitions. It certainly doesn't have to be that, but if you're like, I'm Julia, I'd love to come on and teach your audience how individual leaders can thrive during an acquisition. I'm gonna go
through a five step framework on how they can do that. Like, that becomes really attractive to a podcast host who's talked to all [00:45:00] these other experts.
Dustin: and it becomes very attractive to the person who's in this situation or their manager who has got numerous people in this situation. I think that becomes very bingeable content. It's searchable content. There's a long tail effect where, because it's, evergreen content and like anyone who's now encounters this.
Dustin: New reality is gonna be seeking help and you're like the trusted expert for this event. When this event comes up, call Julia, she and her company at Corporate Leadership know how to navigate change in these major transition points. I think like sometimes we get into these strategies and it's like, oh, there's only like five podcasts that make sense because it's so niche of the industry and the topic.
Dustin: You know, in your case you have a very broad topic and you have huge addressable audience. So I think the key is actually the opposite. It's like, how do I make my scope as narrow as possible to make this super intriguing and I can cut through all the noise and become known as the trusted expert? Not forever, but Let's find the next 10 podcasts that this fits in [00:46:00] and go to them with this message. And if you wanna switch the message a little bit, try the next 10. And you, you really start, that's one of the nice things about podcast guessing is you can try different strategies without being married to them. Right?
Dustin: It's like, oh, I can try this one, I'll try this one. And you'll find where the resonance is very clear. Like clear signals will come through of Wow, this one, like, I got, three really high level appointments from it. This message with this sort of podcast is something I'm gonna repeat. 'cause it, it's working really well.
Dustin: and obviously you and I can talk more, but I, I think the podcast guessing strategy to me is pretty clear. the other huge part of this that you kind of started talking about earlier and we're purposely wrapping up here, is partnerships. I think that is in a B2B world, we can surface a lot of individual, we.
Dustin: Clients through podcast guessing, and we can, most importantly, I would say though, surface partnerships through podcast, guessing that to me, that's the bigger play here. who else already talks to and serves your ideal client in a different way, [00:47:00] right? Like, that's the key question here. And so
you mentioned, I would think taxes attorneys, true human resource experts, change consultants, the people who are gonna come up with a new org chart and like, you know what I mean?
Dustin: Like the, there's like different layers of need within a company whenever they're experiencing a major time of transition. I think your sort of special sauce here is you meet individual leaders. Where they're at, which is they're not getting talked to from the change management consultant who's coming in and talking about the financial picture and the projections and the org chart, and we need to recruit a new COO and all this, you know, and then there's the tax specialist who's like, how do we make mergers and acquisitions work from a tax standpoint?
Dustin: There's any number of consultants and people who work with these types of companies all the time, and they're not trying to be a coach to the individual leader, but they could see how bringing you in on a deal or as part of a team or as a referral could make them look a lot better because you're gonna work almost at like the boots on the ground [00:48:00] level to make this transition work better for everyone.
Dustin: And that's just not the area of expertise for most of the people that are in this world, I would think. And you know, the world better than I, but that's, my mind really starts opening up into like, one good strategic partner could give you all the business, you could handle, The key becomes, how do we find that strategic partner?
Dustin: One of the great ways to do that is through podcast guessing. And one of the places I, and I'm, I know I'm just rattling this at you, but like, one of the ways to think about that is let's say you find a podcast and you're like, wow, this leadership podcast would be really good for my message. And start looking at the host and then start looking at the other guests and be like, wow, which of these guests would be a great partner for me?
Dustin: He's coming on, or she's coming on and talking to a leadership podcast about, I don't know, whatever the HR implications or the tax implications of mergers and acquisitions. 'cause they work with companies going through this all the time. Then you come in and say, Hey, I'd love to talk to you about how I can make your job easier and I can be a resource to these same companies.
Dustin: We can have a referral [00:49:00] relationship or however that looks. I think pretty quickly you can find a couple key strategic partners who bring you in sort of as part of the service package or introduce you to those key leaders as
part of their delivery of their scope of work for the same companies going through the transition already.
Dustin: How does that land as an initial thought?
Julia: it's great. And I think there's, it just makes me think of the leverage opportunities. and in this market it's when you're dealing with maybe less volume, like say a handful of companies at larger contracts than a bunch of little one-on-one clients. I think those, those strategic partnerships really make a lot of sense too to try to just open up,
Julia: open up the floodgates there.
Julia: Yeah.
Dustin: Yeah, you have an attorney or a CPA and their specialty is, I'll just keep using mergers and acquisitions, but any sort of, any of these things, right? and, and you kind of come into them maybe through a podcast relationship. It's like, Hey, you spoke, you've spoken in this [00:50:00] podcast. I've spoken in this podcast.
Dustin: I'd love to have a conversation about how I could do some value add training for your clients, right? And then it starts with you doing a webinar, a workshop, virtual training, and you're teaching their pool of clients who are all leaders going, you know, navigating some major change at their company about the need to meet people at a personal level.
Dustin: During this time and that you have the solution for that. And like, here's how coaching works. Here's the framework that I work with these people through and here's how the results that you could expect. And it's like a win for them, the employee. It's a win for this, middle client here, the whoever's hired this tax attorney or whatever, and it's a win for the tax attorney.
Dustin: 'cause you're a value add to them. You're not trying to compete with them. And the idea would be you could reciprocate at some point where you get into a new company and they're like, Hey, who do you know, that has this service? And you're like, oh yeah, I've got, a CPA in my Rolodex that I'd love to introduce you to.
Dustin: because maybe they're, think about this, you know, or they wanna be able to prepare better for this and they don't know all the implications. [00:51:00] And so, you know, that's the power of strategic partnerships is they
are ongoing, they're. Repeatable, they're deep and they're, often reciprocal. But I think in your case, you're gonna be more of the recipient than the giver because of the level of the organization you're trying to work in.
Dustin: at least initially. But, you know, as you have your own larger footprint and your own larger scale company, I think there's a lot of room for you to be a good partner back. honestly, I've been in this for a long time. A lot of these people just love not only giving the referral, they just, they love the fact that they've got this sort of a team or the Avenger team, that they can pull in and be like, Hey, we got a new client, Julia, you're coming in.
Dustin: you're gonna give them a coaching package to take care of all their leaders. You know, Jill, you're gonna go take care of this aspect. Because there are companies who, this is their, bread and butter is the some piece of this, but it's not all of it. And none of them want to serve all of it unless there's some really, really massive company.
Dustin: But those are going to the publicly traded companies, right? Like you're trying to play in a pool where these a thousand person employee. [00:52:00] Team or companies, this isn't something they go through all the time, right? This is a pretty major event for them, and they're looking for outside counsel. And I think you can do that directly through podcast guesting.
Dustin: And I think you could totally find partners and a lot of those partners could be daylighted through the podcast guesting. Like that's the idea of the flywheel, is you're doing the expertise sharing and then, you know, you're gonna email leads and, and direct sales to these leaders in transition, but you're also developing relationships with the host, with the other guests.
Dustin: and that builds your authority. And then you just keep doing that. And they're like that. That's what creates the flywheel effect that actually generates, recurring, activity for your client acquisition. So, whew. Well that was a lot. I know, we ran over time, so I apologize, but like, what would you say sitting here at the end of this fire hose, would be your biggest takeaway today
Dustin: far?
Julia: Yeah, no, this, was fantastic, Dustin. So I'm taking away, starting with the podcast guesting for. Podcasts that are speaking to that corporate leader audience or those HR [00:53:00] leaders, that are listening to those podcasts almost as a first step. And then from there kind of parlaying into looking at some of their guests for potential strategic partnerships to
Julia: grow even more.
Dustin: And then with the eye towards, once you do get an engagement. Then we kind of turn on the second flywheel, which is the internal marketing of how do we turn this one first engagement into a very long-term relationship where we're constantly coaching people within this organization. Right? Like, I think that's the three tier approach that I took away as well.
Dustin: well, you're awesome, Julia. Thank you for being so open. I know you're, new in this business, relatively speaking. you've got an amazing vision. I, I'm super aligned with your seven figure leap vision for three years. if people are listening and they're like, I need some more Julie in my life, I want to connect with you, or I want to, you know, actually have this need, what would be the next, best thing for people to do, to go deeper with you?
Julia: Absolutely. Well, I would love to, I know we'll, throw my, my LinkedIn in the show notes to anybody that wants to connect with me directly. And I also have, a little gift for the [00:54:00] audience@corpleadership.com slash level quiz. we'll have a quiz right there that goes through, for different levels of leadership within a, an organization, kind of where, where someone fits into that and what are the strengths and challenges at each level.
Julia: and give some great recommendations on where to go from there.
Dustin: Perfect. Well, that sounds like a really useful framework for other people's podcasts who, are all about this, right? So, great call to action, and I love it. So corp leadership.com/level quiz. And yeah, if you wanna check out, Julia on LinkedIn, it's nar, but it's spelled w OJ in ar. So if you look, up WOJ.
Dustin: You'll find Julia. Julia, you are a gift. Thank you so much for being here, for being so open. I'm sweating, I'm like throwing out ideas, rapid fire. So thank you for being on the receiving end of that so gracefully and, look forward to talking to you again as soon as we can. Okay.
Julia: Me too. Thanks so much. [00:55:00] [00:56:00]